HL7 communication with Nettalk - possible?

[Wolfgang Orth]

Hello all,

is it possible to communicate with another software in HL7, using Nettalk?

From what I read, HL7 is located on layer 7 (hence its name?) of the OSI-model.

Is anyone able and willing to share, how such a, Example Request / Response looks like.

Does such a HL7-Request look similar? I mean, without that XML-stuff of course, but with their own brew of ||^yadda||whatever||^yadda||more yadda||.

Maybe something like that?

Code: [Select]

HTTP/1.1 200 OK
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2020 11:28:19 GMT
Expires: Thu, 04 Jul 2019 11:28:19 GMT
Content-Length: 796
Content-Encoding: gzip
Content-Type: text/xml
....

MSH|^~\&|KIS|ADT|LAB|ADT|200510141345||BAR^P12^BAR_P12|ADT03|P|2.5^DEU&&HL70399|||AL|NE||8859/1|||2.16.840.1.113883.2.6.9.66^^2.16.840.1.113883.2.6^ISO
EVN||200510141345
PID|||943246^^^KIS^PI||Nissing^Walter^^^^^L||19480403|M|||Finkengasse 4&Finkengasse&4^^München^XA-DE-BY^89654^DEU^H
PV1||I|CHI^202^2^CH^^N||||||||||||||||654325^^^KIS^VN||||||||||||||||000000|||||||||200510091820
ZBE|234345^KIS|200510121230||REFERENCE
DG1|1||K35.-^Akute Appendizitis^I10-2005||200510141345|ED|||||||||1.1|432113^^^^^^^^^^^^DN||||23543^KIS|A
DG1|2||K35.-^Akute Appendizitis^I10-2005||200510141345|AD|||||||||1.2|432113^^^^^^^^^^^^DN||||23544^KIS|A
DG1|3||K35.0^Akute Appendizitis mit diffuser Peritonitis^I10-2005||200510141345|BD|||||||||1.2|432113^^^^^^^^^^^^DN||||23545^KIS|A


Is HL7 able to communicate with a Nettalk Webserver or maybe Simpleserver?

That yadda-parsing have to be done manually with StringTheory then. But it would be neat, if Nettalk could be used basically.

Thanks for any input,
Wolfgang

[oggy]

Assuming HL7 can communicate via socket, the answer is yes, simpleserver from Nettalk will do it...

[bshields]

Hi Wolfgang,

Given the HL7 standard is OSI-Level 7 (ie Application) its independent of transport. Just like xml and json describe data but are also independent of transport method.

HL7 v2 works like lots of very old systems that use a record identifier at the beginning of each line that in turn defined the fields that would follow on that line. Think back to mainframe systems in the 70s and 80s.

HL7 v3 is based on an xml style syntax.

Your ability to interopt with other systems via Nettalk is likely very true, NT can do pretty much anything.

But, just like sharing xml or json with other parties, where the data needs to be secure, some methodology to ensure security would be required. This doesn't appear to be part of the HL7 messaging standards. Not unsurprising given its pitched at the ISO-7 level.

Regards
Bill

[Jane]

Top of my head, Wolfgang, in my limited experience I don't think I've seen request/response.

Typically what we've used HL7 for is things like placing an order to a lab (in which case HL7 is sent from the ordering application to the lab) or to receive results (in which case the HL7 originates from the lab when they are ready).  In both cases (sending and receiving), after whatever handshaking may be required information is "pushed" from either the ordering entity or the resulting entity.

We had an interface with LabCorp 10 years ago where our orders were generated as individual text files consisting of lines of HL7 and SFTP uploaded every 15 minutes, and then the SFTP batch process checked for individual text files for results (from previous orders) and downloaded them into a folder that an HL7 parser service monitored.

We've had others where VPNs were used to communicate.

For help understanding the ||^yadda||whatever||, a good free tool is "HL 7 Inspector". 

I think Mirth Connect (which has a lot of transforming power) still has a free version:  https://consultzen.com/the-zen-guide-to-mirth-connect-for-vendors/

I guess the bottom line is not really the HL7, but with whom you're trying to connect and what kind of connections they support.

FWIW....

Cheers,

Jane

[Bruce]

Hi Wolfgang,

>> is it possible to communicate with another software in HL7, using Nettalk?

So HL7 is not a "communication method" - it is a "file layout", so you can rephrase your question as

>> is it possible to communicate with another software in (HL7 / CSV / XML / JSON), using Nettalk?

In other words, from a nettalk point of view, you are passing some data backwards and forwards and the format of that data is irrelevant. NetTalk doesn't care if the data is XML or CSV or JSON or HL7 or EDI or ICS or any of a bunch of other formats.

so, let's change your question a bit;

"Can you create and consume HL7 files in Clarion".

And the short answer is - yes - and it's not hard to do at all.

[Aside: HL7 is a form of EDI - which follows a very similar pattern.]

HL7 is a "fancy" CSV. It's just CSV with 2 added "levels".
In your example the | separator is used as the "C" (comma). So that's the first level.
and this would be trivial to parse with StringTheory right?

Then the second level is a ^ separate list.
So this would be trivial to parse with StringTheory right?

And the 3rd level is a * separated list.
So again trivial to parse.

You just loop through each level, and parse each field as needed.

It's very simple code, and I've done it for clients a few times. It's typically only a handful of lines.

cheers
Bruce

[Wolfgang Orth]

I guess the bottom line is not really the HL7, but with whom you're trying to connect and what kind of connections they support.

Yes, seems like that.

Right now I have only the request from doctors, who would like our program (checking infusion-drugs of a regime against each other for chemical incompatibilities) be integrated into their everyday-software (Patient-Data-Management-System). No software vendor involved by now,so I have no information. I want to learn about the mechanism before, so when (if ever....) we get in contact, I do not ask stupid questions.

I prefer to ask my stupid questions here in the family! :-)

Thanks
Wolfgang

[Wolfgang Orth]

Your ability to interopt with other systems via Nettalk is likely very true, NT can do pretty much anything.

Hope so! ;-)

But, just like sharing xml or json with other parties, where the data needs to be secure, some methodology to ensure security would be required. This doesn't appear to be part of the HL7 messaging standards. Not unsurprising given its pitched at the ISO-7 level.

Security seems to be the red-headed stepchild of this industry.

[Wolfgang Orth]

Hi Wolfgang,

>> is it possible to communicate with another software in HL7, using Nettalk?

So HL7 is not a "communication method" - it is a "file layout", so you can rephrase your question as

>> is it possible to communicate with another software in (HL7 / CSV / XML / JSON), using Nettalk?

In other words, from a nettalk point of view, you are passing some data backwards and forwards and the format of that data is irrelevant. NetTalk doesn't care if the data is XML or CSV or JSON or HL7 or EDI or ICS or any of a bunch of other formats.

so, let's change your question a bit;

"Can you create and consume HL7 files in Clarion".

And the short answer is - yes - and it's not hard to do at all.

Thanks for setting things straight, Bruce!

It is as I expected and had hoped. The requesting side will send something ugly to my server, I ripp apart everything and send send back some beauty.

Cool! LOL

[rjolda]

Hi Wolfgang,
It has been a long time for HL7.  As I recall, HL7 is a format as well as a transmission network.  Transmissions are sent down the line and the intended receiver grabs it and then processes it.  There are modules that will do all the HL7 packaging/unpackaging for you.  You might be better off using Clarion to move data between the providers' patient management program and HL7 module.  That's what we came up with many many years ago. 
FWIW,
Ron Jolda